February 10, 2009
Felton-for-Tinsley deal no given
I'd be careful about putting too much weight in that espn.com story, suggesting the Charlotte Bobcats and Indiana Pacers are in "serious'' discussions about swapping packages including Raymond Felton and Jamaal Tinsley.
Chris Sheridan is a very good reporter. However, I just had a conversation with a knowledgeable source who said there's little or nothing "active'' about talks between the Pacers and Bobcats. They have talked, off and on, for a long time and the Bobcats are open to taking Tinsley. But the way I hear it, the Pacers aren't receptive to doing what it would take to make a deal (as in take bad contracts and give up good players).
Here's what is true: The Bobcats are undecided about how best to deal with Felton becoming a restricted free agent. Michael Jordan said as much Monday in a conference call with me and Associated Press reporter Mike Cranston. Jordan said his intent was to re-sign Felton, but he added that doesn't make Felton untouchable with the Feb. 19 trade deadline looming.
Some other things I found interesting in the Jordan interview:
-- He questions whether the "Summer of LeBron'' -- the 2010 free-agent class -- will involve as many stars changing teams as some would speculate. Jordan said the Collective Bargaining Agreement gives such advantages to the retaining teams (longer contracts, larger raises) that it would be foolish for the Bobcats to hoard cap room in anticipation of making a star signing. I have to say his reasoning is sound on this, but i still wonder if it's best for them to already have $52 million-plus in cap obligations two seasons away.
-- When I asked him about drafting Adam Morrison and Kwame Brown -- two rare top-3 draft misses -- Jordan said that's the gamble involved in selecting high school players or players who weren't tested in elite college conferences. He also mentioned European players, which I guess covers the Detroit Pistons selecting Darko Milicic second overall.
-- I was impressed by Jordan's reaction when I asked him why more fans aren't engaged by an improving team. Jordan might be one of the world's richest athletes, but he gets it that plenty of others are hurting in this economy, and it's no given they would make sports tickets a priority.
-- Jordan made sure to re-emphasize his interest in buying more shares in the Bobcats. I think he'll end up owning controlling interest, although I don't think that happens anytime soon.
Posted by Observer Sports on February 10, 2009 at 08:07 PM | Permalink
for a beat writer for the bobcats, do you ever break a story before espn?
Posted by: flipster | Feb 10, 2009 8:35:07 PM
cmon trade, let's do this!
Posted by: Bro D. | Feb 10, 2009 8:53:38 PM
the trade is going to happen because foster and tinsley arent playing against the cavs tonight anybody wondering why?
Posted by: mike | Feb 10, 2009 9:03:00 PM
well, flipster, if you read carefully (they teach you this at UNC) then you would see that bonnell said that the source he talked to said that the talks arnt as active as people think.
id rather take a 100% accurate late report than a 30% accurate first report.
man i wish that time warner deal never went down....and im surprised that sean may didnt eat the little kids at the game yesterday, or DJ for that matter.....
Posted by: reggie | Feb 10, 2009 9:06:29 PM
Bonnell, If he is a good reporter, and what you say is true as far as the trade talks go, then why would he report the talks as serious?
I'm honestly curious. Would you guess you have different sources?
Posted by: Yeah? | Feb 10, 2009 9:10:26 PM
You're are just plain stupid. Nothing you wrote makes sense.
Posted by: RP | Feb 10, 2009 9:20:14 PM
to be honest, the only player id take with jamal tinsley would be marquis daniels. i mean, jeff foster? whats he good for? space.
Posted by: reggie | Feb 10, 2009 9:21:21 PM
Tinsley hasn't played the entire season. Foster was rules out with a sore lower back.
Posted by: RP | Feb 10, 2009 9:22:11 PM
Tinsley isn't playing because he hasn't all season. He's been benched. Thats why
Posted by: Thomas | Feb 10, 2009 9:27:24 PM
I'm glad you're "honestly curious'' because if you'd heard what I heard tonight (see my story in tomorrow's Observer), you'd wonder why that ever ended up on espn's web site. I'm not saying the Pacers and Bobcats weren't in talks. I'm not saying there's zero chance of re-tinkering something or other if the Pacer become desperate. But that deal, as portrayed, was never going to happen.
Posted by: Rick Bonnell | Feb 10, 2009 9:31:52 PM
You're a tease RB!! How about you give us a little taste tonight?
What are the Bobcats demands? I assume it would involve the Pacers 2009 1st round pick?
Is that what's making the Pacers say no?
If their 1st round pick is in play, is the deal on?
Posted by: ???? | Feb 10, 2009 10:10:28 PM
Rick, the pacers are working VERY hard to move Tinsley so they can hopefully beat the grievance from the players association. I think as they get more desperate they may call us back up and say "want Granger" Nah, they'd rather suit him up to play than that, but you get my drift... Good article though...
Posted by: tattoo | Feb 10, 2009 10:26:17 PM
I don't think this trade will happen (as is)because Larry Brown has shown to be smart and he would like to get Tinsley and Foster with Marquis Daniels, and that trade doesn't work under NBA rules, unless Indiana send some cash to Charlotte (which will not happen). The Bobcats would be over the limit.
BTW: Reggie, we would need Foster because the guy is an actual presence under the rim. A 6-11, athletic guy and a very good rebounder (specially Offensive Rebounds). His stats are 7pts-7rbds (3 OffR) per game. In case you forgot, we are one of the worst rebounding teams.
Posted by: Rob C | Feb 10, 2009 10:29:23 PM
Ohh and he only plays 20-24 minutes per game. Those numbers are way better and more useful than Mohamed. Just remember how he grabbed 10 Offensive Rebounds in the 1st half against the Bobcats just a week and a half ago. He owned the Bobcats in the low post the last time they played and he is very consistent at that, in my opinion, way better and cheaper than Mohamed and Varejao.
Posted by: Rob C | Feb 10, 2009 10:32:32 PM
Was that the same knowledgeable source that told you that Radmanovic was going to play in the Miami game?
Go to hell, Bonnell!
Posted by: Will | Feb 10, 2009 10:34:14 PM
If they trade Felton for Tinsley the thug, then they lose a fan and ticket buyer in me.
Posted by: Justin | Feb 10, 2009 10:44:53 PM
The trade is not Felton for Tinsley. Felton's contract expires this season. The Cats are skeptical that they will be able to re-sign Felton. So Felton is gone after this season and the Bobcats are trying to get something in return. If the Bobcats are able to get in return a very capable PG, some depth at the wing and inside, and also dump Muhammed's contract, then it is a great move.
Posted by: Jack Hoff | Feb 10, 2009 11:05:22 PM
true, he is a rebounding force. pardon me. as i skimmed over his stats i focused mainly on his ppg.
but ever since primoz ive opposed tall, somewhat skinny centers. and adding foster messes up our rotation slightly. instead of having diop coming off the bench, do we go to foster first? or do we play both of them, foster at PF and diop at C?
Posted by: reggie | Feb 10, 2009 11:18:35 PM
I think it is a good deal if they can get Rush from it. One of few trades that would work out for both sides. Felton wouldnt have to take the shots in Indiana and would give them some good gaurd minutes and help with ball handling. The Bobcats get another player under contract for one more year, and a quality player who wont demand 35mpg and miss every big shot down the stretch. Give the reigns to DJ. Rush is a good future starting 2 who can pick up some knowledge from Bell before his contract winds down. I do actually like the Bobcats getting some manageable contracts that extend 2-3 years, as they will not be in the 2010 free agency madness, it will keep their options open pending how strong they finish the year and start the next one.
Tinsley's not a thug either. Someone who thinks that would be a little naive of all basketball players (and celebrities in general) and put a ton of weight in what the media reports and how they spin it.
Posted by: Nick | Feb 10, 2009 11:21:34 PM
Jack Hoff, when you're taking in garbage contracts and an overpaid cancer(especially when you've got a coach who doesn't deal with attitudes well) this is a stupid move. It has about a 90% chance of backfiring. If you keep Felton the worst thing that can happen is you let him go, which isn't that bad. Being stuck with Tinsley could be terrible. No one else is willing to take Tinsley, we shouldn't be the morons who do.
Posted by: Eddie | Feb 11, 2009 12:05:12 AM
If we get Foster and Daniels it would be the Bobcat's who have to give up the pick. Anybody who doesn't like this deal will have amnesia when the Bobcats are in the playoffs.
Posted by: carl | Feb 11, 2009 2:15:09 AM
Morrie, you really don't need all those multiple repeats of your post. That is the act of a a juvenile delinquent.
As far as the trade goes, it would be a mistake to take Tinsley considering that only one other team has shown an interest in him and that to me says all their is to know about what kind of person he is. As a player he is a pure pg but he obviously has issues.
Larry Brown doesn't always work well with his pg's. Just look how well he got along with Marbury.
Posted by: Garrett | Feb 11, 2009 2:52:01 AM
Just think! If we trade for Tinsley & Daniels, the bar business in Charlotte immediately ascends 25% & we will have the best fighting team in the NBA - - hands down. Why are we even thinking about this move. Moneywise, Daniels negates the deal anyhow. Foster can get some boards, but he's 32 with little upside. All of this garbage is coming up now because we would like to get Felton signed long term, but at a realistic number. If it works, the smoke screen did it's job. If we end up trading him, you'll know he wanted to much money to stay. I know we would love to part with May & Mohammed, but please don't make Tinsley part of the equation.
Posted by: happy | Feb 11, 2009 7:14:18 AM
This gotta be a joke right? What team in their right mind would want Tinsley...if the Bobcats need any player from the Pacers, it would be "Daniels, Rush, or Hibbert"
Posted by: Poppa Reu | Feb 11, 2009 8:11:40 AM
I'm well aware that Felton's deal expires. He's restricted though, and he's from the area. I bet he'll be more than affordable. Yeah, maybe you get some other pieces, but no one that's going to be around long-term. Why give up on a point guard who has future ahead of him? It's not like anything we get from Indy is going to be the final piece of a championship team.
And Tinsley very much is a thug. How many times as he been in scuffles up in Indianapolis? It doesn't matter how you spin it or what the media says, but if you're a grown man getting arrested on multiple occasions over a relatively short time period, you're a thug. I'm little amazed to have been called naive by someone that either can't read or doesn't care. If the Bobcats want folks in the stands, they'll screw themselves. Tinsley will have the opposite effect.
Posted by: Justin | Feb 11, 2009 8:34:46 AM
I'm a fan of Felts. I think he's a better prospect at PG than DJ.
However, I think it would be hard to turn this one down from the bcats point of view.
Rush is a star waiting to happen, athletic 6'6 player that can hit the three and defend.
Foster is the unsung player that does the little things like rebounding. you're telling me you'd rather play Frenchie over him right now?
Tinsely should be a very good pg. Sometimes scenery changes help, and LB knows a thing or too about dealing with malcontents.
Get those three for Felts and that's almost a go, add in getting rid of May and Nazr, and suddenly the bcats are a deep vetern team that would be fun to watch.
The only thing I would think that would stop it, is if the bcats managment doesn't see DJ as capable of being a full time pg.
Posted by: A Fan | Feb 11, 2009 9:09:44 AM
i do not like that trade. I'm guessing Brown is thinking about all those Pacers/Pistons battles that Tinsley owned the court. But that is completely different. Raymond is a much better athlete!
Posted by: Jed74 | Feb 11, 2009 9:31:14 AM
I am not a fan of this trade. I really hope that ESPN is jumping the gun on this one. It wouldn't be the first time that The Worldwide Leader In Sports made up a story to get people talking.
Posted by: Token | Feb 11, 2009 10:21:47 AM
Daniels, Tinsley, and Hibbert for Felton, May, and Mohammed.
Posted by: Dr. Bobcats | Feb 11, 2009 10:58:55 AM
OK RB, where is this article that will make us "wonder why that ever ended up on espn's web site."
We are busting to know the juicy dirt you have!!
Posted by: Felton Safe? | Feb 11, 2009 11:11:16 AM
we got it Morrie. Stop hitting Post!
Posted by: mcap | Feb 11, 2009 11:13:35 AM
It wouldn't make much sense to trade Felton right not, especially for someone like Tinsley. With mostly everyone healthy (and the 2 who are coming back after the all-star break included) it seems dangerously trigger happy to even consider moving Felton. When DJ was out and we made the trade for Diaw and Bell we started winning. Sure we went 0-5 after the Lakers game but much of that is to blame on Wallace getting injured. Now by acquiring Vlad Rad (and those coming back from injuries) I still think we have a good shot of making it to the playoffs. Thanks for the details Rick!
Posted by: Chris | Feb 11, 2009 11:17:47 AM
This is the dumbest trade that I have heard all year. Felton is one of the best players on the team!! To trade him for Tinsley is absurd; a player that hasn't played a full season in the last 4year is a joke!!! I don't know why the Bobcats keep using him as trade bait. I rather take the chance of Felton walking than to take Tinsley. The up side on Felton is way greater than Tinsley!!! Just keep the roster that you have and play ball!!!! This might be the last straw as a Bobcats fan!!! What are you thinking about JORDAN????
Posted by: Concerned Fan | Feb 11, 2009 1:04:31 PM
I am a longtime Pacer fan but I really think your coach and tinsley would work well. jt can pass/assist well and organize the floor. he wont shine on defense but not many pt guards do. foster is steady, tough, and grabs rebounds . i dont want to lose foster here . came late to this discussion. is it mays, naz, felton for foster ,daniels, and jt???
Posted by: stlouispacer | Feb 11, 2009 2:51:49 PM
Larry Brown does not want another back up center and a guy who shoots 20% from 3pt range.
He did want a back up center and got one in Diop. He wanted a pf and got one in Diaw. He wanted 3pt shooting and got it in Vlad. The trade is stupid as is.
I know LB likes players to drive the ball but Daniels just cannot shoot at all. Do you really want the ball in his hands down the stretch?
Posted by: Bobby | Feb 11, 2009 6:29:03 PM
No trade that will be stupid. Young and upcoming Felton for old Tinsley....people must be crazy...it would change the already built up chemistry. The point are key in LB's systems and to change that now. We would be back at the beginning of the season playing wise. We are on our way up dont mess that up....just get a shooter guard
Posted by: Bobcat FanD | Feb 13, 2009 2:04:12 PM
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