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August 17, 2007
They looked silly in Philly
PHILADELPHIA -- Some quick observations from Friday night's loss to the Eagles.
+ Don't start screaming for Jake Delhomme's head just yet. The offensive line was horrible. And, even though, David Carr's stats weren't bad, he didn't do anything dramatic enough to prompt a switch. Not yet anyway.
+ Remember all the talk about upgrading the return game? It sounded like a good plan to let rookie Ryne Robinson return punts and kickoffs. So why did the Panthers keep trotting Nick Goings out there to handle kickoff returns? Goings gave the Panthers exactly what you'd expect from him: a 22-yard average on four returns. Robinson averaged 32 yards on his two returns.
+ I've said it before and I'll say it again, rookie Dwayne Jarrett will be the opening-day starter at wide receiver opposite Steve Smith. Jarrett hasn't done much yet because he missed a chunk of camp with an injury. But Keary Colbert and Drew Carter continue to show why they've never been able to claim starting jobs.
+ Actually saw Eric Shelton drag a few defenders on his 6-yard run late in the game. Along with a nice block against the Giants last week, it would be one of the two highlights of Shelton 's three years with the Panthers.
+ A lot of people got excited when the Panthers traded for former Chicago safety Chris Harris. He may turn out to be a nice pickup and had looked really good in his first week of practice with the Panthers. But there's a reason why the Bears were willing to part to him. The book on Harris is he's a good tackler, but he can't turn and run on the deep ball. That showed on a first-quarter pass where Chris Gamble got beat and Harris was late in providing help.
+ Defensive end Otis Grigsby was one of the few bright spots, recording a sack and pressuring the passer a few times.
Posted by Observer Sports on August 17, 2007 at 08:10 PM | Permalink
Comments
Horrible performance by Panthers. Nothing looked good and if they play like this in regular season, we can hope for the lottery pick.
Colbert needs to be released and Biddles should be kept.
Panthers need lot's of work on Offensive line for quality running game though I think they have not used full playbook yet. Jake seemed a lil' scared in the pocket while all three Philly quarterbacks just threw the ball in couple of seconds.
Smith should not be used on out routes (Interception play today). He is too speedy to be wasted like that.
Defense does not utilize blitzes at all. They need to start getting more aggressive and blitz more often instead of being more conservative.
Posted by: Cat's Fan | Aug 17, 2007 8:50:00 PM
I don't agree with everything you write..but At least your not a "homer" like...Steve Beurline..while I think he's the best Panther QB of all time...I hate to listen to him do games...all he does is Praise jake Delhome no matter what!! it's so obvious he's good friends with EVERY panther that's been on the roster for a few years...a player can be plaing lack luster or terrible and he will find a way to make it a positive. Carr in for Jake? Maybe not yet But Jake keep playing like this...there will be no reason not to. He was HORRIFIC! and No excuse for fumble'n..that play either It came from his VISION SIDE! not blind side! He does that all the time! he has no pereferal vision! or pocket pressence..never really has. U are right bout Harris....I pray Sally is good.
Posted by: Cheven | Aug 17, 2007 9:01:29 PM
Looks like panthers Are really going to Regret Not Signing Marlon McCree.
Another observation....Lets not forget T. Davis is on the "Bust wactch" this year..after Avg'n...4 tackles a game last year (look it up) He's still getting lost! WHY!! didn't the panthers draft Derrick THomas..of TEXAS!! Fox loses games on Draft Day not game day! THen Shelton....and tell me this...why haven't the panthers...Cut shelton for Haynes? I Mean I understand the size issue..but what good is the size..if he can't hold on to the ball..and gets out played by a smaller back...who hits the hole harder and runs faster...
I really really think...Rosario..could be a steal. and I also think...McClover...should start Over Rucker as well. but we all know panthers and their Overt Sentimentality!
Posted by: Cheven | Aug 17, 2007 9:05:08 PM
Real bold prediction there Pat.
Anyone should start over Colbert and Carter. I put up the same numbers as Carter did Friday night and I was at home on couch. If Biddle doesn't make the team, the coaching staff should quit and try something else for a living.
Its time the Panthers cut the dead weight and quit praying their draft picks pan out. Hurney & Foxy seem to have trouble admitting they made a mistake.
And can somebody figure out where Jake's confidence went.
Posted by: Red | Aug 17, 2007 9:19:27 PM
First, my definite, set-in stone opinion-Mixson really is as a awful as I've been lead to believe. OMG, I could do better AND I'd have to use terms like thingy, ask my husband dumb questions and I think I could have given a better picture of what was happening.
Second, I hope the Panthers were using the pre-season as its intended purpose, try new things and players.
Third, maybe Foxy was playing fox in the henhouse, we don't want a repeat of being the best thing since sliced bread!
Posted by: madamepurrs | Aug 17, 2007 9:48:10 PM
Its a new offense, therefore, you're trying new things a good portion of the time. And its fairly obvious they've got a lot of work to do.
As for Micky Mixon, yeah, he's horrible. I bet at least 80% of Panther fans agree. Its actually pitiful thats the "best" they could find. Someone ought to start some sort of website or petition.
Posted by: Red | Aug 17, 2007 10:00:01 PM
While this game was terrible everyone bear in mind this is the PRESEASON and MEANS NOTHING. This is the time to work out the kinks and sort out the deadweight players who need to be kicked to the curb from those who can push strong against the current during the regular season. We will learn a lot more from a game like this where we got our asses kicked in than the game last week where we put it on the other team.
I'd rather us look bad here and not show our stronger hand to the league than to be kicking ass and have everyone putting the bullseye on our backs.
Posted by: Ben | Aug 17, 2007 10:04:01 PM
I sure hope you are right Ben.
Me, I saw a team with the same glaring holes as last year: no running game, a slow OL, and a defense slow up the middle. Plus we downgraded at WR -- at least so far.
Gross looked shockingly bad for our best supposed lineman. And does Trgo not understand that TEs can come off the line and catch passes? Seriously. We NEVER cover them. Ever.
Cheven is exactly right about draft day and sentimentality -- it could kill us this year. Beason may turn out to be a great LB but it was insane to not take a S.
(Marty had a perfectly functional -- and more, he knocked McNair out of the Balt game, our best D effort last year were it not for two fluke tipped balls -- Morgan backup in Chris Draft, but Draft was a little too vocal.)
And swear we released Jarrett Bush last year so we wouldn't have ANOTHER better cover CB than Gamble. Marshall should start, at a minimum. Me, I woulda moved Gamble to FS long ago where his lack of swivel doesn't kill you.
At this moment we do not have a single safety on the roster who can defend a pass. Couple that with our LBs tendency to misread the backfield (Seward did it several times, Davis ALWAYS does it, and Diggs just stands there) and the middle of our pass defense is non-existent.
I don't want to sound like Jim Cramer-screaming-at-the-Fed, but somebody has to. Somebody has to hit the panic button.
(Wasn't Marty a hoot during the TV broadcast last night? Looked like David Stern at a bookies convention.)
We are staring at 4-12 right now. And I'm not certain there is a way to fix it.
Posted by: JAT | Aug 18, 2007 3:06:38 AM
Chemistry of the offensive line was totally different with Kalil at center and Hartwig at RG. Horrible! Too much vanilla on D. I miss Del Rio. The only bright point was that we still fly under the radar while we address this $#*+. Oh yeah, it didn't count. We're still 0-0. The worst thing is that we will hear from Will now. The people you meet when you don't have a gun. Sigh.
Posted by: S.H. | Aug 18, 2007 4:30:45 AM
I wish Jake all the best and hope he does well......But any person with football IQ can tell that Carr has a better arm, more accurate on his passes and runs VERY well. Did you see him on the FRAN TURKENTON rollout? If he was not tripped up by the last man he would have got that first down, and the run from 9 yards out, the boot to Dwayne and the deep ball to Biddle.......People say he is playing agianst 2's well he is PLAYING WITH 2's also. I wish Jake all the best and hope he does better at Home because if he plays like he just did at HOME it might get interesting,,,,,,,Go Panthers!
Posted by: BigKahuna | Aug 18, 2007 5:38:51 AM
My concern with carter and colbert is their ability to play all over the filed. DC has been good on deep balls, but last night on the intermediates he seems to have chicken grease on his hands. KC just disappears in the game, and when he does show up he seems to be obviously open as in a coverage breakdown. Jake needs to spread the ball, but he needs the confidence. If jake gets confident in you, then he'll keep feeding you (maybe too much). Jeff King caught a couple of good one's over the middle, keep feeding him. He was the same way as a Hokie, made Randall and Vick2 look good alot of times.
Posted by: shoneal | Aug 18, 2007 6:14:47 AM
Start the Cowher watch.
Posted by: patrick | Aug 18, 2007 6:40:23 AM
Lost power last from a storm in Columbia, so I was unable to see the game........seems as though that was a good thing. I am just happy this is still preseason.
Posted by: 230Panther | Aug 18, 2007 7:18:27 AM
It truly was a pitiful performance by the Panthers in last nights game. They didn't even belong on the field to compete with the likes of the Eagles.
The first stringers performance is lackluster, mistake ridden, uncoordinated and heartless!
I saw better performance from the 2nd and 3rd stringers. At least they were giving their all with a great deal of heart. Maybe, the 2nd and 3rd stringers will get the job done?
I wish and hope for a winning Panthers team this year. But, even though this is trial and error time, I don't see great prospects on the horizon for this group of performers(correction - lack of performing).
Is this all too apparent to the Panther's fans what a woeful state the current team is in? Are the coaches aware of the scale of difficulties and lack of progress? Maybe, frightened to death over what they already know?
Well, this season is nearly at the beginning. I only hope for a drastic improvement in performance , so that watching the Panthers play week to week is not a painful experience!
Posted by: Dandy1949 | Aug 18, 2007 7:29:06 AM
Guys honestly we were singing their praises last week now we are ready to hang the lot of them - that is the NFL! We had a lot of close games in 03 when we went to the SB that could have gone either way and I personally thought we didnt have the team that could go the distance that year - well we end up taking NE to the brink and definately played one of the best SBs ever.
Preseason is our laboratory, it is our time to tinker with the team and let some of the less talented people take the field. It is also the time to work out the kinks. We won all our preseason games last season and went 8-8 after that. This time means a lot more to the team than it should to the fans because it is their time to see who really has the talent and who wont be around come Sept. 2 when the roster is whittled down to 53. I fully agree the team stunk up the place last night but again if we were giving it full effort it should be a wake-up call, and one that I would rather get now than later in the season when the playoffs are on the line. I mean really do we think at all about what we did in the preseason in 03, or for that matter what the Bears or Colts did last year in the preseason. Absolutely not, the only games that count are the ones that start in Sept. I still believe we will be ready for those, and we have this game to learn from and two more in the chute to go.
I still think we have the talent to go the distance this year and the season hasnt started yet, treat the preseason like it is meant to be and lets not panic.
Posted by: Ben | Aug 18, 2007 8:33:14 AM
Hello people Im baaaaack, Who remembers my comments about Delhomme a couple of weeks back? This blog is looking a little more knowledgable though and thats what I like to see. Todd you hit it on the head, the panthers fans need to get off the Super Bowl Stats arguments because that WAS four years ago. The pick that he threw to Lito Sheppard was another typical Delhomme moment. Its starting to look like everything has to be perfect for him to produce the way the fans want him to. The sad part is that the recievers are going to continue to get a bad rap because they are forced to try and make plays off of poorly thrown balls, and expected to bail #17 out. (just look at the productivity of the second string, its like night and day)But its time to come to the conclusion that maybe he just isnt that good. The NFL defenses have figured him out and his run should be coming to an end.
Posted by: The Critic | Aug 18, 2007 8:44:42 AM
pat???...is it not time to hit the panic button and bench delhomme in favor of carr?...shouldnt we have drafted a QB and a SAFETY???....isn't our coaching getting worse instead of better?....is steve smith the only NFL talent we have at a skill positon?....if peppers doesnt get a sack or if morgan doesnt get the tackle, arent QB's gonna burn our butts all year long?....im serious...what are the answers to our problems this year....im starting to believe even 7 wins is an over-rated prediction for us this year...and i truly believe that david carr gives us our best chance to win....and one last thing....im starting to think we need a franchise running back too...we should've signed lewis this off-season....he is better than anything we've got on the roster!!!
Posted by: yancyc | Aug 18, 2007 9:53:33 AM
one last thing....maybe we can just go 1-15 and we can get mcfadden, booty, or slaton next year!!!
Posted by: yancyc | Aug 18, 2007 10:01:18 AM
Here's what I worry about guys. This looked almost like a carbon copy of last season. Against a legit defense our offense looked pathetic. The offensive line got abused first team, second team, third team. You can talk all you want about this being the preseason, but I wasn't seeing too many holes being opened up in the ground game. Forget the scheme for a minute. If you can't beat your man one on one you have no chance in this league.
I'm not too sure about the defense yet because everyone's not at full strength and we really haven't seen the defense as a whole yet. I know for a fact Morgan can make an impact but I also know for a fact that he want start the entire season. Peppers really wouldn't have made much of a difference last night, the coverage was pretty sloppy. And whose going to provide pressure when Peppers starts recieving a constant double team. An aging Mike Rucker? An undersized Stanley McClover? An unproven Charles Johnson? A white guy named Dave Ball? An overweight Kris Jenkins? Same problem as last year from what I can see. No consistent pressure from the front four, something we thrived at a few years ago. Lots of holes in what I think should be a decent secondary. Though I'm not too thrilled with what we have at safety.
This is the bascially the same team we fielded last year which is why I'm not getting too excited about this season. Inconsistency may be a problem like it was last year.
Something else to note. The Eagles are a team that hasn't had many major injuries (except for McNabb last year) for a few seasons. They looked in midseason form last night and seemed to take this game very seriously. Not saying the Panthers didn't, but I was surprised at how the Eagles got up for a game that doesn't go in the record book.
Posted by: Johnathan | Aug 18, 2007 10:16:51 AM
Aging, undersized, unproven, white, overweight. Which adjective doesn't belong on this board?
Posted by: S.H. | Aug 18, 2007 11:05:16 AM
Almost every person on this chat, was churping a different tune last week..!! This is pre-season, which means for all the BandWagon fans, IT Does Not Count..!! 122 home gamea and counting, and Ican tell you they will be better when the season starts... If you don't like the team, jump on another Bandwagon for a few weeks, we will welcome you back after that team fails for you...yawn, I hate these chats about doomsday, the sky is falling, look out...oh my....
Posted by: Catsnmbr1Fan | Aug 18, 2007 12:28:59 PM
fickle fans huh? Hit that panic button.
Posted by: steve | Aug 18, 2007 1:34:23 PM
If the defense doesn't learn the fundamental art of tackling, then we are staring at 6-10 at best, no matter what the anemic offense does.....
Posted by: Phil | Aug 18, 2007 3:23:53 PM
I really think that Rucker will get cut, for the younger defensive ends. We have some outstanding talent at that position. Biddle should make the 53 man roster also. They need to cut Colbert and Carter, they are both garbage and have had plenty of time, to develop their game.
Posted by: Rod | Aug 18, 2007 6:15:10 PM
I really don't appreciate the negative comments about our QB Jake Delhomme. It makes me so mad when fans say negative things about there team, quit predicting negative things. Grow up and be positive. SO WHAT JAKE HAD A BAD GAME, Tom Brady threw 2 interceptions this week in his Pre- Season game. Jake is our guy, and will be our guy until he retires, so just quit it. I am sick of everyone downing the guy. Either your a fan or not. If your a Panthers fan, support him for goodness sake. You guys are starting to make me second guess what Panthers fans are all about. Back in the 90s fans ere not like this. I'm done.
Posted by: Ronnie | Aug 18, 2007 7:01:16 PM
I like Jake Delhomme, but you have to admit shaky is an understatement. two solid years of throwing off the back foot, happy feet when rushed, and worse than that He has the wrong attitude and leadership. He comes off the field pissed and down instead of taking alot of ther responsibility, then bringing your offense together on the sidelines and building confidence. I'm now totally confinced he can no longer lead the Panthers the way they should be lead. Shame on him for not standing up to his crappy play, and poor leadership skills. It's time to give someone else a chance with the first string. Maybe will discover that David Carr can lead or Jake will get his act together when he knows he might be a starter anymore. anyway the rest of the team is questionable in all areas, but only time will tell
Posted by: BT | Aug 18, 2007 7:38:02 PM
Why didn't we draft or sign a good safety? The pass defense last night looked worse than last year. Really bad. Too many passes over the middle with all the LB's and DB's totally out of position. Run defense on the other hand looked good. Please Fox, cut Colbert and Shelton. Why, why do you continue to mess with them? Please keep Biddle. Kudos to Dave Ball, Otis Grigsby, McClover and the guys that are over achieving, we have too few of those types.
Posted by: Ron | Aug 18, 2007 9:09:55 PM
People people....Panther world! what is goin on. If you're really a Panther Fan then you know better than to be downing the team as such, when all that negative talk could really doom us. They have enough pressure as it is. Grant it, I think some of what was said is true, but it has to be constructive folks. I was just tuning in to the article and had to come to the site to see what people were saying about last night. Knew it was going to be off the chain.. Im not on the site much but from time to time, last week I didnt look, why?, is was a successful outing..but when lighting strikes..lol.."get it lighting" from the game which might should of been postpone...joking..... loosen up. But when lightning strikes people get the after effects and lose it. Calm down....ok first JAT, yes, we do not cover Tight Ends, and havent in some time...We just got by with it, but to many teams kno now. Everytime we play Dallas they kill us. Any team in the past that we've played against with a better TE have destroyed us. We have to stop that, seriously! Because I ganRUNtee that whom ever we meet when we get to the playoffs, yes I said when...Is going to have strong play from that position.
Coach Fox, yes he has to get things in line. But this was his first loss in quite a few preseason games. Fox is one of the best in the business in evualuating in the preseason.... The Colts have been horrible the past 3 yrs in preseason, last year 0-5 and it doesnt count nor affect them. We ARE not the Colts. I know, no one is. Until someone beats them they are still the CHAMPS and the team to beat.
Its is so delightful to know that, it is good its happening NOW and not later.. It wont be, a few mishaps may occur but we are in store for a different but good year. We are living our story now, of what its going to take to get to ARI and really want it. Our story is unfolding before our eyes.....But people, dont you think Fox is better than that than to throw all your business out in the street?..Got to keep it under wraps. Playing possum! We people and the media coming at the team so hard its a wonder the Panthers dont take a bunker mentally from game to game...just talk to no one or do nothing, but with the 53 on the roster, the heck with everyone else....Its harder than it really looks out there...trust I am a deep Panther fan but I felt a little unease when I saw dejavu...Johnathan you said it best, "Carbon Copy"...Copy of the play we seen last year...It actually felt like that until I pinched myself and realized its a NEW YEAR and that I cant think that way...Cant be with the majority.......
And then this peps...To show up in Phil not remembering the last time we were there. Against a team that helped us turn for the worse last year...Thought they would have taking it more seriously as a pregetback...Now if they did switch lineman, then they are just getting ready and preparing themselves for possibly another linemans going down. Injuries and lack of passion have derailed us from getting back to AT-least the NFC Championship the past 4 years in a row. And Peppers was out last nite, didnt even travel, valuable piece missing, even with not being on the sideline...remember he is one of our leaders, dominate leaders, he might not have helped with the points on the board, but we have to get pass goin thru the motion in some games when key players are out, ala Steve Smith game 1 & 2 last yr. Emotion and leadership we lack when that happens and others are afraid to step up and not allow a beatin like that...And Steve Smith was not playing hard, trotting off the line, maybe our 'Golden Child' wasnt tryna get to banged up, cause the coaches were clearly working on something else and wasnt trying to get him involved...getting loose I guess..But didnt mean to go on like this...well wait a minute....yes I did....Im just coming to you, being sent to tell you, "It Is Indeed Allright"...Lets give this team and coaches and organization a chance. We are one of not many teams that know what it takes to get to the "Big Game"...Not many more....Phil knows of course, Colts, Pats, Broncos, Steelers, Ravs, a few others but we play pretty much most of them this year so.... but Philly, many of the players have been there the past 6 years including 4 straight NFC title games...So if there are Panthers fans that jump on and off......you mileswell just shut your tv off and not watch til Sept 9 against the Rams which will indeed come back harder to avenge that 16-0 defeat last year...So.....our story unfolds...But I get it peps....yes they have to get in tune in what they want to do and execute, thats it...Execution....PLAYERS, not coaches. NOTE: They better keep Colbert though, we are gonna need him later on in the second half of the season...he's gonna sursprise alot of people, just hope its not against us.:) Then think of how you would be writing on this site then.....uh? you dont want that...But I do hope you all have a bless day/night and for some, go to church in the morning, and if not, say a prayer in ""thankfulness""....and be bless and take care and I will be chiming in in time. Enjoyed you! Much Love!
Remember this to shall past and they WILL face tough times although they have already but this is the test....Do they, The Team, Fans, really want this. Thats the question...All of you hearted Panthers out there. Ask yourself that and see then
HOW FAR WE GO! They all need us, truely from within, eachother... I'm OUT! D/4verCPfan
Posted by: Dee/4everCPfan | Aug 18, 2007 10:04:51 PM
They have to know what to expect from first themselves, they should have grown together enough to know that...then what to expect from other teams....how they are fo' real..serious are going to come at us, bring it...and thats what we have to do and get back to doing....they're not afraid and curious of the Cats anymore...we have to change that by endz meet....Game 1' Holla
Posted by: Dee | Aug 18, 2007 10:17:49 PM
All you delhomme haters need to quit with your bullshit...Day after day year after year this guy gives his all and you know it.Yeah he makes mistakes but every quarterback in this league does...Even the precious tom brady and payton manning...I know your saying how can you compare jake to these guy's...well jakes just as good as they are when we have a decent O-line...Our WR's besides smith can't get open 98% of the time so therefore he has to hold the ball longer than normal...The running game isn't and hasn't been there since stephen davis left....I could go on and on...All im sayin is give the man a break...stop putting all the blame on him for a change and place the blame were it is deserved. Truth be known foxy needs to stop being so nice and put his foot in a few players asses!!!
Posted by: jay | Aug 19, 2007 3:08:30 AM
There is no I in team
Posted by: stating the obvious | Aug 19, 2007 5:38:14 AM
Man its funny how some of you fans just cant come to grips with the fact that Delhomme just isnt that good anymore. Ever since the NFC championship game he has been getting exposed. I see alot of comments talking about how good of a guy he is and how he gives his heart to the franchise and thats all well and good, but that doesnt win games or add to the stat sheet. Granted the defense has its issues of falling apart but the offense doesnt even put up points to help the defense out. Three and out seems to be the offensive theme, and a great deal of that falls on the QB. Thats just the nature of football, he is the field general and if he is throwing bad passes and obvious passes to Steve Smith then nothing is going to change. Please dont use the arguement that this is only preseason, because its not like he can just turn it on when he wants to. He has been displaying a mistake riddled outing far too many times to be considered in the upper ranks of the NFL and wether you like him or not you have to accept that. Please dont compare him to Brady at all. #17 is average as pie at best, and Carr will be the starter by game 6.
Posted by: The Critic | Aug 19, 2007 6:11:06 AM
maybe the colts did go 0-5 last preseason....but they barely played their starters either....against philly friday....our starting offense played a half...and in that half...we didnt gain a hundred-freaking-yards....jake delhomme is not a leader...or even an adequate passer...its time to drop him to 3rd string and start carr...bottom line
Posted by: yancyc | Aug 19, 2007 6:24:31 AM
I have no idea how you can try to continue to use the '05 NFC Championship to say that Delhomme is a bad. The man was down to the FIFTH-STRING running back, Jamal Robertson. When was the last team you saw compete under those circumstances. As far as I can tell, you should be able to use those playoffs as an example of how Delhomme CAN lead a depleted team--on the ROAD, mind you--to great heights.
Posted by: Michael Procton | Aug 19, 2007 10:34:43 AM
Tell 'em, Michael!
Posted by: S.H. | Aug 19, 2007 11:58:17 AM
Super Bowl Panther World! Just get ready!
It will come!
P.S. Jake knows the deal....
Posted by: Dee | Aug 21, 2007 9:43:50 PM
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