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May 13, 2008
Shhh! ... It's a surprise ...
Many Panthers fans won't like this, because it joins a growing list of national media outlets with repesentatives speaking out and saying Carolina could be a comeback playoff team next season.
First, it was SI's Peter King. Now, it's ESPN's John Clayton, who lists the Panthers as the No. 1 surprise team in the NFL for the 2008 season.
Clayton says, with the return of quarterback Jake Delhomme and the renewed emphasis on a power running attack, the Panthers could win 10 games and make the playoffs.
-- Charles Chandler
Posted by Observer Sports on May 13, 2008 at 06:22 AM | Permalink
Comments
Oh crap, don't let the team see that! They need the motivation!
Posted by: Daniel | May 13, 2008 7:01:32 AM
Yeah these are the same morons that predicted us to win the Super Bowl and we all know how that ended up. So it is what it is.
I think the Radiers will be the surprise team this year. They might actually win 5 games.
Posted by: John Fox | May 13, 2008 7:24:59 AM
nfl live predicted us 18th in power rankings,even below the cardinals,so we are still under the radar.good!
Posted by: ray | May 13, 2008 7:42:48 AM
People make a big deal out of these things when they first come out, then forget about them by the end of the season. If you think this is important, keep score, expose the good predictors and the bad predictors and maybe we can get rid of the worst.
Posted by: Ben | May 13, 2008 7:58:39 AM
Expectations, don't mean jack. What people think does not affect what happens on the field. The NFC division rivals know they can't sleep on the Panthers. What matters is health, talent, and competitive intensity. Jake Delhomme, when healthy, is a pro-bowl caliber QB that has led his team to a near Superbowl victory. The return of Moose will help out the best receiver in the game. Jonathan Stewart will restore the power run game. The secondary and linebacking corps will be stronger than they have been in a very long while. The question marks will be on the lines. There are a lot of new beefier bodies being thrown together. And there is no obvious pass rush on the line where Peppers slipped drastically last year. If the lines come through and the players stay healthy and play with heart, this team will be competitive regardless of what the media thinks. Go Panthers!
Posted by: Dave | May 13, 2008 9:22:45 AM
I don't think its so bad that people are predicting the Panthers to be a "surprise" team. That won't get anyone's head too big on the team, since "surprise" implies that we weren't any good last year. Not to mention we were definitely the surprise of the season in our Super Bowl year. The worst is when these sportswriters and ESPN guys say we're a lock to win the NFC South or, worst of all, pencil us in as a Super Bowl team. Things always go south from there...
Posted by: Haywood Jablowmi | May 13, 2008 9:26:49 AM
We've never been a "surprise" team except in 2003. Usually we are more along the lines of:
Surprise, we ran off right tackle on first down.
Surprise, we tried a 56yd field goal instead of going for it on 4th and inches.
Surprise, the other team's tight end is open across the middle again.
Surprise, we got a false start to cap off a momentum building drive.
Posted by: Chet | May 13, 2008 9:54:35 AM
Too funny chet, but that is right on. Don't forget the surprise draw play on 3rd and 10.
Posted by: LOL | May 13, 2008 10:12:33 AM
Chet, you weren't surpised we went to the NFC championship game in our second year of exsitence? Otherwise, great post.
Posted by: rayray | May 13, 2008 10:16:12 AM
is a team a game or two out of the playoffs the previous year and who is predicted to make the playoffs the next year really a SUPRISE team?
Posted by: matt | May 13, 2008 10:17:25 AM
I don't know why it would be a surprise to anybody that with our starting QB under center again, that we can win 3 more games than we did with Carr and Vinny running the team for most of last season. That is kind of the most important position in football ya know.
The Bucs went from 4-12 in 06 to 9-7 in 07, and getting a better QB was the only real improvement to their offense.
Posted by: monstercat | May 13, 2008 11:46:46 AM
My only hope is that the "surprise" is a positive one. I never thought we'd beat the Vikings and then lose 15 straight games while George Seifert watched it all happen.
I never want THAT surprise again.
Posted by: Air Borden | May 13, 2008 12:44:46 PM
Anyone know if John Clayton has ever made an accurate prediction in his life?
And, if we actually knew exactly how they would do, it wouldn't be too exciting, would it? But then again, it would be most excellent to know that they were going to win 10 games. Now WHICH ten games... Sorry for these rantings.
Posted by: Fat Cat Fan | May 13, 2008 1:59:08 PM
LOL Keep em comin Chet. Dont stop there.
Posted by: chets funny | May 13, 2008 3:12:14 PM
Damn, the negativity is back. I was really enjoying everyone being optimistic about our team's chances next year.
Posted by: SlayerGhaleon | May 13, 2008 3:38:53 PM
That wasn't much of a surprise now, was it Slayer?
Posted by: wisiwyg | May 13, 2008 4:25:02 PM
We will win at least 10 games next year no doubt. Just we better have a surprise year from tyler brayton on the passrush or we are going to get picked apart.
Posted by: Cameron | May 13, 2008 5:40:23 PM
It shouldn't be a suprise to anybody if the Panthers do well this year. When you suffer the types of injuries that we have the last couple of years the suprise would be still winning with Carr under center. Plus since this is supposed to be a "make or break" year for Foxy maybe he'll start playing to win games rather than not to lose them!!! I've never been a fan of the whole we're up by 3or7 so let's do the infamous 3rd and 10 draw play! Did Henning 4get to take his playbook with him when he left or what? I know I watch every game faithfully but if I as a fan know exactly what play is coming next most of the time I'm sure NFL coaches and players aren't fooled much either. How bought some suprises on offense like trying to blow teams out instead of intentionally trying to live by the name of the Cardiac Cats!!!!
Posted by: #1 Fan | May 13, 2008 5:48:22 PM
#1 Fan.. Henning was never the problem with the offense.. Coach Fox was the one that demanded that we not loose the games with our offense, and let the defense win the games. That hasn't worked the last few years, with Jake back, and a power running game, we should be able to win 10+ games. Look at the schedule, also Tampa now has to play # 1 teams, since they won the division.
Posted by: Catsnmbr1fan | May 13, 2008 8:35:10 PM
Don't worry guys, I'll find a way to lose some more games for us and keep us out of the playoffs. How many touchdowns will I give up this year, maybe 14 or 15? I'm tired of teams picking on me and throwing at me all day.
Can I go back to playing receiver?
Posted by: Chris Gamble | May 14, 2008 4:21:57 AM
Check out this link from Pro Football Weekly.
http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/NFL/NFC/NFC+South/Carolina/Features/2008/parr051308.htm
We are definately on the national radar. GO Panthers!
Posted by: mdizzy5 | May 14, 2008 6:20:26 AM
The main point of the article and what concerns me is that i feel we have the talent but i question the talent of the coaching staff.
crossman has got to be one of the worst s.t coaches in the league.i cant believe hes still here.i also have no use for trgo.
he shows no ability to improvise or adapt to what offenses are doing. i can only assume that these coaches have foxes blessing.
another thing that disturbs me is that players dont seem to improve very much in foxes system,except for the self motivating smith.players actually seem to regress or stay the same, ex. wahle,wharton,jarret,hartwig,foster.
i cant believe noone could teach foster to carry a football so he wouldnt fumble.
the panthers also seem to have an inordinate amt of injuries every year. is it conditioning? is it training regimen?
this year should reveal a lot.
Posted by: ray | May 14, 2008 8:48:05 AM
I'm with you on the injuries thing ray. In 2004 we had more injured starters than any other team in the league, and in 2005 we were running too thin by the time we made it to the NFC championship game to even be competitive. Other teams have injury issues too, but ours seems to come by the bushel. Still, it could very well be the physical type of game the team likes to try to employ. The IDEA is hard hitting run stuffing D and mauling run pounding O. Maybe the style of play has a higher likelihood of injuries? I don't know, but I look forward to seeing what the team can do this year after filling some glaring needs and getting Jake the Snake back. Let them fly under the radar and then blow everyone up week after week as far as the media attention goes.
Posted by: James | May 14, 2008 11:03:23 AM
Nobody on our team ever improves much? What about Chris Harris? He came in after an average couple of years at Chicago and made a serious impact here. He led the league in forced fumbles, even.
Posted by: SlayerGhaleon | May 14, 2008 11:14:04 AM
Mike Wahle got worse because he got old. Travelle Wharton got worse because he tore his ACL. Dwayne Jarrett has been bad from the start...he couldn't get worse. Justin Hartwig got worse because he destroyed his groin.
Oh, and as for "nobody gets better": the aforementioned Chris Harris, Jeremy Bridges, Todd Sauerbrun, Jason Baker, Damione Lewis, Chris Draft, Ken Lucas, John Kasay Al Wallace, and, oh yeah, Jake Delhomme have all had their greatest play or productivity after coming to Carolina from another team. Guys like Deon Grant, Dante Wesley, Marlon McCree, and Ricky Manning have never approached their level of play with the Panthers after they left. Further, we've signed at least three guys (Nick Goings, Jordan Castens, and Brad Hoover) who have both gone from undrafted to starter, as well as developing undrafted fan darling Matt Moore, who couldn't even make the Cowboys roster. I could certainly go on, but I don't have all night, you know?
Posted by: Michael Procton | May 14, 2008 5:23:22 PM
The cat's REALLY out of the bag...front page, MSN.COM:
"Two of these five teams — Carolina, Cleveland, Dallas, Jacksonville and Minnesota — will be in the Super Bowl semifinals next January."
Posted by: Michael Procton | May 15, 2008 9:57:20 AM
Youre kidding me right.harris didnt even have training camp with us and youre crediting the panthers for making him a good player. hes said in interviews that the bears coaches ,like ron rivera ,teach that style he plays.lewis was a starter with the rams and hes been a career backup with carolina.i predict ian scott will beat him out in camp.bridges came to us as a backup and this year hell be a backup guard/tackle.
ken lucas is a perfect example of my point.he looked great the first year he was with us. hes gotten steadily worse every year .chris draft was a good player before we got him and he stayed about the same.kasey has been kicking since fox was with the giants,cmon procton.
oh, where is saurbron and wallace now?
grant is a2nd rd pick who never lived up to his potential and wesley is a career backup who is on the bubble.
jake never played for another n.f l team so you cant say the panthers made him good.
i love picking you apart procton.dont you ever get tired of looking foolish?
Posted by: ray | May 15, 2008 11:01:54 AM
*Chris Harris actually did get traded DURING training camp, and turned from a backup to a Pro-Bowl caliber starter.
*Damione Lewis, as a backup, has been more productive than he ever was in St. Louis as a starter.
*Jeremy Bridges was a part-time starter who got 11 starts in two years and then was cut by Arizona. In Carolina, he's started 24 games in two years, including a two-game suspension during which he would have started.
*Ken Lucas had his best season in, yes, his first year WITH THE PANTHERS, and has had trouble with nagging injuries (and improved depth at the position) since.
*In 2006, Draft increased his career high in sacks by 57% while also matching or exceeding career-highs in FFs and FRs. And if he were a "good player before", it takes something to maintain that level of play as a player ages.
*John Kasay has been better in Carolina than he was in Seattle. Period. There is no way to argue otherwise.
*Todd Sauerbrun is out of the league. As soon as he left Carolina, he stopped being a Pro Bowl punter. The guy we traded him for, Jason Baker, became a Pro-Bowl caliber player as soon as he got here.
*Al Wallace, having produced better here (even as a backup), than he ever did in Miami, signed with Buffalo last year and tore up his knee before the season started.
*Deon Grant may not have lived up to his potential, but he certainly was far closer here than he has been since leaving.
*Dante Wesley is a "career backup" who has still been able to be more productive and useful in Carolina than anywhere else he has been.
*Delhomme was on the Saints' roster for five full years, and couldn't EARN his way on the field (over Aaron freaking Brooks, mind you), but did play in six games and start two. He got here and became a Pro Bowl QB.
You may love "picking me apart", but you sure as hell didn't do it there.
Posted by: Michael Procton | May 15, 2008 1:43:02 PM
You sure are a glutton for punishment procton.o.k lets continue. julius peppers was horrible last year in what should be the prime of his career.jenkins went from a great d.t to a fat ,unmotivated whiner, during foxes tenure.if bridges is so great why isnt he a starter? you havent refuted any of my other points about the players we mentioned. we cant even use jake as an example because we dont know how good or bad he was before he came to carolina. heck, fox is so stupid he had rodney peete as his starter. so fox didnt recognize jakes talent either.
baker was a great punter for us in 06,now hes even starting to slide.nevertheless , i dont think fox is out there giving baker/kasey kicking tips.
kemo was good enough to get a fat contract.now hes just fat,and unmotivated.do you see a theme here procton,unmotivation.that goes right to the head coach. go ahead procton, make another inane post so i can make you look silly again.
Posted by: ray | May 16, 2008 8:34:56 AM
Julius Peppers has always been an overrated, lazy POS who takes every other play off. That's been true since the day he started the game, and it will continue to be true. That's not a coaching issue, it's an issue of personal accountability and pride, which Peppers apparently lacks on both counts.
Kris Jenkins is another player who suffered a career-changing injury (two, actually), but still remained productive. As a DT, he contributed to the team's run defense, which, on a YPC average, has remained at the top of the league, and the play of our DTs last year (yes, Jenkins and Kemoeatu) allowed a late first-round pick (Beason) to rack up more tackles than anyone in Panthers history. Who do you think was keeping those linemen off of him? Perhaps, too, Fox should have been able to personally monitor Kris Jenkins' problems with eating and alcohol. Good coaches are ALWAYS able to help players off the field (see Taylor, Lawrence; Lett, Leon; Irvin, Michael...I could go on and on...)
Kemoeatu, as well, fits in this same category...a productive run-stuffer. DTs are not supposed to rack up 80 tackles and 10 sacks in a 4-3. That's not how it works. I'm not sure what about him, exactly proves that he's "unmotivated," but I'll take a guy who comes in, plays hard every down, and does his job without worrying about his stupid stats.
Jeremy Bridges was a starter for the Panthers as of the last time he was healthy (pre-dental surgery.) He could certainly still be. Again...if he started more games here than he did in Arizona (among a better group of offensive linemen), he must have gotten better.
Yes, we do know that Delhomme was pretty bad before he got to the Panthers. In those same six games I mentioned, he had a TD:INT ratio of 3:5, and a QB rating of 68.7. Since, he's had a TD:INT ratio of 97:59, and a QB rating of 86.0. Your point about "seeing Jake's talent" might be valid, but unfortunately for you, Fox DID put him in a mere 30 minutes of football later than he possibly could have. Further, if he had that kind of talent, one might have thought he would have been put in as the Saints were winning 7 or less games in three of his first four years in the league.
Jason Baker had a 4.4:1 ratio of kicks inside the 20 to touchbacks last year. In '06, it was only 2.6:1. That doesn't sound like a punter "starting to slide," and his stats last year still blew any numbers he had ever put up pre-Carolina out of the park. And I find it very interesting that you're going to say that you can't credit Fox for coaching the punters and kickers. How much coaching do you think he does of anybody? That's the point of hiring a staff, and having put the right people and system in place for the players to succeed.
Oh, and finally...John Fox took a team with an undrafted backfield (Delhomme, Goings, Hoover) to the conference championship. I'd love for you to find another team to do that.
Sad, that you think I'm a glutton for punishment. You seem to be a glutton for ignorance.
Posted by: Michael Procton | May 16, 2008 9:52:12 AM
You still havent refuted any of my points but you are still combative so ill have to give you more examples of how fox cant develop players. anderson and mathis were both 3rd round picks. at one time mathis was a starter.now he wont even make the team as a backup.good coaching foxy. as it looks now, anderson will never be more than a backup,if he makes the team.
i want you to admit to me procton, did fox do a terrible evaluation of mathis talent or did he do a terrible job developing his talent?
Posted by: ray | May 19, 2008 7:59:43 AM
I don't know if you know this, but the coach doesn't do the draft. That falls to the scouting department and GM. Good call, though.
Posted by: Michael Procton | May 19, 2008 8:12:14 AM
Oh, so fox sits in the war room with his thumb up his #$@ while the draft goes on.
he might as well draft because he cant teach or develop talent to save his life.
it is what it is.
Posted by: ray | May 19, 2008 2:23:50 PM
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