August 29, 2008
Breaking down the trade
So now that the Panthers have added veteran quarterback Josh McCown via trade with Miami, what does it mean?
Here are some early thoughts on the matter:
-- Make no mistake about it, McCown is being brought in to be the No. 2 quarterback behind Jake Delhomme. McCown's base salary of $1.95 million this season and $1.75 million in 2009 tells you everything you need to know about that. McCown is still young (29) and has good experience (31 starts in six seasons with the Cardinals, Lions and Raiders).
-- The trade does not mean that Moore is more seriously injured than originally thought. He has a deep bruise in his left leg and is listed as day-to-day. The truth is, he has struggled during the preseason. He threw two interceptions and fumbled against the Steelers Thursday, and finished the four exhibitions without leading the Panthers to a touchdown. Even though he didn't get to play with the starters, his play didn't do a lot to encourage team officials that he is ready to run the team consistently efficient if something happens to Delhomme. Moore has outstanding potential, but his development is still in the early stages.
-- Say goodbye to Brett Basanez, and that's too bad. He's a promising young quarterback and one of the best guys the Panthers have ever had on the team. Hopefully, they'll bring him back on their practice squad.
-- Remember all the fuss this preseason about whether or not Brett Favre was going to un-retire, and then whether or not he'd be with the Packers?
The Panthers' ability to obtain McCown is a direct trickle-down from the trade of Favre to the New York Jets. After that happened, the Jets released Chad Pennington and the Dolphins signed Pennington. That's what made McCown, who otherwise might have started for Miami, available.
If Miami hadn't obtained Pennington, McCown probably would have started. But once Pennington was on board, McCown was expendable because Miami rookie Chad Henne had a solid preseason.
Dealing away McCown before he even played a regular season game was an expensive move for the Dolphins, who paid him a $2.5 million signing bonus earlier this year and cannot recoup that money. The Panthers inherit McCown's base salaries from that deal, as listed above.
-- Charles Chandler
Posted by Observer Sports on August 29, 2008 at 07:19 PM | Permalink
Posted by: SYRPIS | Aug 29, 2008 7:47:42 PM
This is actually a pretty good/solid move. We can take depth at QB. I love Matt "gimme some" Moore but is still unpolished and I think will be a starter
Jakes backup spot comes down to:
Matt "Gimme Some" Moore
Josh "Tears of" McCown
Moore = Powerful arm, intense, young, and mobile, below average awareness, lots of potential
McCown = Good arm, experienced, average awareness, mobile,
WE WANT MOORE!
Posted by: bbbbb | Aug 29, 2008 7:51:39 PM
BTW, great coverage. Thanks again.
Posted by: SYRPIS | Aug 29, 2008 7:52:33 PM
Haha, first McCain throws everyone a curve, and now The Hurneynator fires one off as well. Freaky Friday I suppose.
Good move, I had a feeling the QB market might be a factor.
Posted by: BigMikey | Aug 29, 2008 7:58:39 PM
I read these post quite regularly and have never posted, but I can't sit silent on this one. I am a strong supporter of my beloved Panthers but I don't like the thought of releasing Bret. He preformed better in his limited time than Moore did in his extremely inflated oppertunities. Basanez is not only a great team guy but has shown poise and accuracy on the field. I do believe the McCown pick-up is a good move but I truly believe Bret has more potential than Matt "can't turn it over any" Moore. Just one man's opinion.
Posted by: K daddy | Aug 29, 2008 8:17:47 PM
Maybe Moore goes to the PUP, where he won't count against the 53 for a few weeks. Then we maybe carry Basanez on the 53 until Moore recovers. Then stash Bas on the PS when Moore comes back.
Isn't anybody else curious why Robinson did not get a MRI done on his knee?
Posted by: JR | Aug 29, 2008 8:24:48 PM
I agree with K daddy, Brett should make the side before Matt Moore. If Basanez hadn't have been placed on IR last year, who's to say how we would have gone with him as our starting quarterback? Everyone seems to forget that Basanez was on the Panthers roster first and we only picked up Matt Moore after he was cut by the Cowboys. I'm sure there was a reason that Brett had an NFL team and Matt didn't.
Posted by: Ben | Aug 29, 2008 8:35:01 PM
JR, I have to agree with you and I think that would be the best move the Panthers could make right now. Moore on the PUP list and Bas on the practice squad insures that the Panthers can still develop Bas and maybe give Moore one more shot next season. I like what Bas did this preseason, but I'm much happier with McCown as the backup over him for now.
bbbbb, I've seen enough of Moore this preseason to like McCown better. I think it's a no contest if you really want to put them head to head in a competition for backup. I've seen McCown play more (he's been around longer) and he looks better than Moore did even in his two winning games last year. For those who have no idea who McCown is, here's a link to some highlights from NFL.com. He's good as a backup for the Panthers until Moore develops Moore confidence and poise.
Posted by: James | Aug 29, 2008 8:42:58 PM
You can't put Moore on PUP. They have to be placed on PUP at the outset of camp.
I'm also not sure you can put Basanes on the Practice squad. There are rules about their experience. And you have to cut him in order to do so, which means somebody else could pick him up.
Bas is gone. Sorry...
Posted by: David | Aug 29, 2008 9:22:29 PM
I wouldn't just say Matt struggled, but the whole second team in the preseason has struggled. Matt did good with the starters in the first game against the Colts. Cause he had an offensive line and receivers
Posted by: jake the snake | Aug 29, 2008 9:41:06 PM
I have always liked Basanez. The kid has potential. It was a bummer last year when he hurt his wrist and was put on IR (probably more of a bummer for him, to be sure). I really would like to have seen what he could have done.
McCown was a good call. As last year shows, you can never have too many back up's. I would rather for the Panthers to keep Basanez, and let Moore go, but I'm sure that's not going to happen. Too much hype has been made for Moore.
Good Luck Brett! Your day will come.
Posted by: Juan | Aug 29, 2008 10:04:10 PM
Well of course Basenez looked better against Pittsburg...Moore was going against their first string defense with the Panthers second string offense half the time.
Moore showed last year that he has the potential to be very good, but remember...he's only just starting his second season. It takes a few years for QB's to develop.
Posted by: monstercat | Aug 29, 2008 11:20:16 PM
The annual quarterback conundrum is here: How many QBs do they keep and who will they be? After having tried too often to go into the season with only 2 QBs (Does Weinke as the only backup sound familiar?), they are forced now to keep three but their #3 choice is slightly injured. Plus, they have to expose Brett Basanez to the waiver process if they want to keep him on the practice squad.
Adding to the questions of the final 53 man roster is the problem of who kicks off. John Kasay has not been able to reach the end zone for many years and can barely reach the 10 sometimes. His short kicks give opponents a big start before the coverage team can get down field. Giving the opponents starting position beyond the 30 is a killer and the Panthers can't afford to cut Lloyd. That will probably cost them a linebacker or lineman or someone with only one skill.
Kasay is a keeper because of his field goal accuracy. He averaged 4.5 points a game on FGs the last 2 years. Big numbers when they couldn't convert on 3rd down and had to rely on the defense to keep the score close. But the defense is an unknown so far and his kickoffs are a liability that can't be overlooked anymore. Therefore they have to keep Lloyd and limit teams to the 20 yard line on kickoffs.
Posted by: FrankieB2 | Aug 29, 2008 11:30:25 PM
Wow, The "Matt Moore" bandwagon just tipped over..LOL... I have said, since last year, that Brett Basanez should be in line for a backup position. He has been very good when he is in the game, considering he is always going in, with all of the scrubs on both sides of the line.. Moore, started last year, and did ok, he was told not to loose the games, and he won (2) games against two playoff teams that pulled their starters to keep them fresh for the playoff's. Please don't put to much into what he did last year.. He was the Best healthy QB they had, but to many people this summer, were ready to push Jake out the door and elect Matt Moore as the team Starting QB.. Moore is a good 3rd string QB, that you groom for the future, period. Every 4 to 5 years the Panthers flip their young QB's, Randy Fasani, Craig, Lytle, Lewis...Moore will be the next one, probably..
Posted by: Catsnmbr1fan | Aug 30, 2008 1:05:01 AM
Sorenson's article reminds me of one of Moore's responses to what American youth should be told concerning football...
"Stay in school. Study."
Now it looks like both Brett and Matt may be out. I would like to see the Panthers sign another veteran at QB after the final cuts are made. But, with the experience McCown has (just trained with Panthers former offensive coordinater in Miami) he should be fine after a couple of weeks. Still.... I'd rather be safe than sorry. I'm still suffering from shock after watching Carr's dissapointing performance.
Posted by: SYRPIS | Aug 30, 2008 6:26:26 AM
The one thing that bothers me about this trade is ...
Josh McCown, an experienced, yet unproven QB, cost us a late-round pick in 2009 ...
Daunte Culpepper, former Pro Bowl caliber QB, could've been obtained for free ...
Granted Culpepper can be at times a complete jerk, he's capable of being a backup QB if his ego wouldn't override his talent ...
Posted by: Shane | Aug 30, 2008 6:36:06 AM
McCown is equal value to another bust we had here, who was run out of town last year... anyone recall who that was and how well that worked out when Delhomme went down
Posted by: Takesus | Aug 30, 2008 9:31:49 AM
mccown is a solid backup. i just hope jake stays healthy till josh learns the off. moore was bad against pitt but he was playing the starters with our 2nd team and they all played bad. moores a gamer,as he showed in games that count last year.sorry baz.if you showed something the team wouldnt have had to pick up mccown.i think baz is too old for the practice squad.
Posted by: ray | Aug 30, 2008 10:33:52 AM
I think Basanez is still eligible for the practice squad, but its also very possible someone might claim him for their roster like we did with Moore last year. Hopefully he stays here.
Catsnmbr1fan, you say not to put too much stock into Moore's performance last year. Yes he went against a couple teams who weren't playing their starters. But the same thing applies to Basanez. You can't put too much stock into what he did against 4th stringers in the PRESEASON. He's shown promise and I wish we had split the backup time more evenly between him and Moore so we could see what Basanez does against 2nd stringers, but we didn't and as a result we have no idea how good he really is. Plus if I remember correctly Moore had an outstanding preseason with the Cowboys last year playing against 4th stringers, better than what Basanez has done this year, and thats how he ended up with us.
Posted by: DB | Aug 30, 2008 12:17:44 PM
I am not that good. I had chances in the regualar season against the starters a few years ago and never moved the ball and threw interceptions. In the preseason I only moved the ball against the second stringers. My favorite pass is the go route down the side line. I am too short to see over the offensive line so the short and intermidiate routes are tough for me to be effective. Thats why most of my passes are short passes to the receiver bedfore he even gets 5 yards down. Really guys it is time for me to go. McCown is better than I am and Matt has better intangibles, he just tries too hard sometimes. Maybe I will make the practice squad and be the scout QB. Lord knows I am desperate I even played the role of a DB in practice just so I could have something to do. John Fox and Jeff Davidson, are ok at seeing talent and this is why I was not getting any playing time and was playing behind Matt.
Goodbye everybody it has been nice.
Posted by: Brett Basanez | Aug 30, 2008 12:35:38 PM
Keep Basanez,put Moore on injured reserve if you must or let him go. He was ok Basanez is better. Had he not hurt his wrist last year Jake would have had great backup and our season would have been a lot different. He can also probably spell intermediate since he has a master's degree from a top university
Posted by: AL | Aug 30, 2008 2:13:16 PM
Hah...Matt Moore's "powerful arm" doesn't do any good given he can't throw the ball to a receiver with any accuracy more than 12 yards down the field.
JR, Moore can't be placed on the PUP. No player who has been practicing or playing since training camp starts can be. And Robinson DID get an MRI. Strained PCL and LCL.
Shane, Culpepper isn't a Pro Bowl QB any more. We wrecked his knee, and his career has been effectively done since.
I'm also especially amused that all of these people suddenly realize how bad Matt Moore is. But go ahead, people. Hate on them for what I've been saying ALL along.
Posted by: Michael Procton | Aug 30, 2008 3:23:58 PM
Procton, look at the statistics for the last game and then revise your statement.
Posted by: GGrrrr | Aug 30, 2008 4:46:54 PM
You're talking against Tampa Bay? When our receivers were being covered by guys like Phillip Buchanon and Sammy Davis? Please.
Posted by: Michael Procton | Aug 30, 2008 5:31:08 PM
Anyone who thinks David Carr is better than Matt Moore has no credibility (cough cough Procton).
Posted by: DB | Aug 30, 2008 5:40:18 PM
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